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Chris Mburu 00:00

 

When I look at poverty, it evokes memories of my own childhood. And where I was, I really do not want to see anybody there. So, my whole objective is to try and pull out people - and in particular young, innocent children - out of poverty. How can I help those people get out of that situation?

 

Melissa Fleming 00:36

 

Chris Mburu has one of the most remarkable stories of transformation that I know. His life changed dramatically when his education in his home country of Kenya was sponsored by a Holocaust survivor from Sweden. Now he is the UN Resident Coordinator in the Republic of Congo. And he told me that he is dedicating his life to giving back. From the United Nations, I'm Melissa Fleming. This is Awake at Night. Chris, I'm going to ask you about your work. But why don't we just start by you telling me about the village and what life was like where you were born.

 

Chris Mburu 01:25

 

Thank you very much. I was born in a small village that is called Mitahato. It's in the central province of Kenya, not far from Mount Kenya, for those of you who know Kenya. Beautiful, small village, except that everybody was poor. Kids had difficulties going to school because we had to pay to go to even primary school. But it was a very happy environment to grow up in. And I have very fond memories of growing up in my village although we were all poor. We were little kids. We didn't even know what poverty was. We had enough to eat. At least because Mitahato is in the highlands of Kenya where you have a lot. You know, agriculturally it's very fertile. So, we would grow our food in the garden around our village. We had corn. We had potatoes. You know, if you wanted to eat potatoes, you just went into the garden and dug them out. And if you wanted to have corn, you just walked into the garden and pulled out whatever you wanted. We had beans. Our staple diet was actually quite healthy. We have what was called sukuma wiki, which was¡­ It's like kale. And actually, sukuma wiki in Swahili means push the week. It's like something to keep the week going.

So, it was very interesting. We had no want in terms of what to eat. But then there was a big undercurrent of poverty. Some of us could not go to school without support from elsewhere. And some kids didn't even finish school because they were not¡­ Their parents couldn't afford it. And they were not as lucky as some of us to get strangers walking into their lives and supporting them. It was a very beautiful childhood. But there was a big thing that was underpinning our existence, which was poverty.

 

 

Melissa Fleming 03:35

 

It is a practice in Kenya to charge students in primary school, secondary school tuition.

 

Chris Mburu 03:44

 

It was then. Things have since changed. In 2002, the primary school education was declared free. But it took all these years. I mean, I was growing up in the 70s. So, we're talking about a long period where kids were required to pay for school. And if you didn't pay school fees, you got kicked out of school. And it was just very difficult. It was heartbreaking for little kids to be told you can't stay in school. And, you know, we felt the pinch and the pain because it was also discriminatory. Because some kids could pay and stay in school. Other kids couldn't pay and had to go out of school.

 

Melissa Fleming 04:32

 

So, how old were you when you realized that this was potentially your fate, that your parents could not afford the fees to send you to school?

 

Chris Mburu 04:44

 

Well, you kind of figure it out when you're on top of the list of kids who are going to be sent home for lack of school fees. And the way they used to do it those days - they would call us in an assembly and the names of all the kids who had not paid fees would be read out loudly. And so, it was heartbreaking.

 

Melissa Fleming 05:08

 

So, describe the day for you specifically.

 

Chris Mburu 05:11

 

Well, my school wasn't very far from my house. And, you know, I was raised in this mud house. It was just a mud structure, which sometimes the mud dried up and fell off and created holes. So, you could actually see through the house sometimes. But we were very good. My mother was a very dignified woman. And she always made sure that we repaired our house and there were no holes. But when you get sent home from school several times, you start figuring out what's wrong. Why can't I stay like, you know, my friend? He gets to stay. What's wrong with me? I had a friend. My best friend while growing up was a guy called William Gitau. And William Gitau¡¯s mother was our teacher, so she had a job. And in those days, very few¡­ You could count from your fingertips the number of salaried people in the village. His mother was salaried. So, he was my best friend. We were playing together all the time. Yet, when it came to kids being sent home, I got separated from him. Because his mother could afford to pay. My mother could not afford. And so, then I started thinking, ¡®What is really going on here?¡¯ I mean, you're really small. You're happy. You go out there, and you wait for Gitau after work, and you play with him. But then you your mind starts telling you there's something here that doesn't add up. Why can't I stay in school?

 

Melissa Fleming 06:50

 

Did you ask your mom?

 

Chris Mburu 06:52

 

I asked my mom. One of the things about my mom and many mothers during that time, they kind of hid the poverty from us. They did not want us to think about that. And I guess it was just a defense mechanism. What are you going to do? Telling your kid, we are poor. So, my mother never once pronounced those words. She just said, ¡®Well, you've been sent back, I'll take you back when we get the money.¡¯ But she never said, ¡®Oh, don't worry, we are just so unprivileged, we don't have money. And this is our life.¡¯ She was always like, ¡®Come in! Have a meal. Have this your food.¡¯ And she would make me the best meal in Kenya.

The traditional meal is called ugali, which is basically corn, you know, boiled in water until it hardens. And it's Kenya's favourite dish even today. And then I would go out there and get some of the kale. And my mother would get some oil and prepare it for me. So, as long as I had a full stomach, I felt good. But it was still bothering me that some kids can stay in school, others can't. And mind you, sometimes we would be very happy, because it was a big group to be sent home. Because then you got more time to go and play. And sometimes our mothers would put us out in the field to work. And you know, as they figured out what to do next.

I remember one time when my mother was receiving me after I'd been sent back. And she said, ¡®Well, this is too much. I'm going to just go talk to the teachers.¡¯ She had nothing in her pocket. But she went, pleaded with the teachers to let me stay simply because I was crying for having been separated from my best friends like Gitau. And the teacher just had pity on me and said, ¡®Okay¡¯. And then said to my mother, ¡®Regina, you must bring money by next week otherwise, he's going to come back home.¡¯

 

 

Melissa Fleming 09:10

 

And how did she manage to get the money to keep you or get you back the next week? Did she manage?

 

Chris Mburu 09:18

 

You know, my mother was one of really hard working, one of the most hardworking women in the village. She had no job but there were some coffee plantations around our village, which were run by the French. And my mother would go there and work as a day labourer picking coffee, and then she got paid. But it was so little. It took a lot of time to raise the amount that was required. But she really did try very hard to pay for us out of her own pocket. She was a proud mother. She did not want to see her kid home for lack of school fees. She tried her best. Sometimes she managed. Sometimes she did not. But she was a hardworking woman.

There were times, by the way, when she would tell me¡­ Because she was also a market woman, she would grow¡­ Our village is full of bananas. It's actually¡­ The name Mitahato is the name of a banana. So, if you come to my village, you almost can't see the houses because of the bananas. And so, my mother would grow bananas. And she would¡­ Sometimes she would let them ripen, and then take them to the market. So, she was quite resourceful. And I really loved this, she would tell me, ¡®Okay, you been sent home from school. So here is what we're doing. You're coming with me to the market.¡¯ And we would go to the market, and she would spread out her bananas and beans and maize sometimes. And we would sit there. And I had the greatest time of my life at the market.

I don't know if you've ever been to an African market. And you see all these women, you know, in beautiful African attire, and they have the cloths spread out on the ground. And that's where they place whatever they're selling. That was my mother. And then I would be sitting. You've seen these kids who sit next to their mothers, that would be me. And the fun out about that¡­ Sometimes I almost didn't want her to get the money to send me back to school because that meant I would leave the marketplace. Because at the marketplace I had lots of fun, and lots of food to eat. Because all my mother's friends would pass by and say, ¡®Oh, here's a mango. Oh, here's a potato. Here is you know, like¡­¡¯ I would get fed by my mother's friends. And sometimes it was so much fun that I would say, ¡®I really don't want to go back to school this week, Mom.¡¯

 

Melissa Fleming 12:02

 

Just how old were you around this time, when you were in and out of school because of your mother not being able to pay the fees?

 

Chris Mburu 12:09

 

I was about seven years old. You know, I had just started school. Those days, we started school at age six. I was kind of delayed because of, you know, financial reasons. So, I started a little late. I think I was seven. So, imagine you're a seven-year-old. You've just started school. You're so excited about school. And then you have to be told, ¡®Go home! The others will continue learning.¡¯ Luckily, I was a good student. I enjoyed school. So, I was able to catch up. And actually, for a big chunk of the time, I used to be the best student in the class, even with the absences. And so that really pleased my mother. But it was still quite difficult.

 

Melissa Fleming 13:00

 

You're speaking only about your mother. So, I assume she was raising you and I guess you had brothers and sisters.

 

Chris Mburu 13:07

 

I had brothers and sisters, but I was the last born. So, this is what my mother had gone through with a lot of the siblings, you know. She really worked hard. My father was present, but he was he was living in a different city. He had gone to try and make a living out there. And he would come at the end of the month. And so, the person that I saw day in day out was my mother. You know how kids, especially boys, are attached to their mothers. But my mother really tried for each of us to make sure that she could provide. And where she couldn't, she looked for help.

 

Melissa Fleming 13:48

 

And so, you had this intermittent education. But I believe you or maybe your mother learned about a possibility that might bring some help? Tell me about that. What happened?

 

Chris Mburu 14:02

 

Well, the fact that my mother was always trying to get out of the house to go and look for money, either in the coffee plantations, or selling things that she grew in the village exposed her to, you know, a lot of things. You know, she was¡­ In the marketplace people talk. You know, so she heard some women saying, ¡®Oh, for those kids who have difficulties going to school, we heard that there is a scholarship programme that the Swedish people are starting.¡¯ Actually, they didn't even say Swedish, they said, ¡®The white people have been seen here asking around for kids who are bright and having difficulties going to school.¡¯ And my mother said, ¡®Huh, I need to talk to those ones.¡¯ And so, it was this kind of exposure¡­

 

Melissa Fleming 14:59

 

How did she find them?

 

 

Chris Mburu 15:00

 

Well, she asked. My mother was¡­ If she had an idea, she pursued it vigorously. And I can just imagine. I can't remember. But I can just imagine she didn't sleep that night. She said, ¡®I need to see those white people, because my child needs to get an education without interruptions.¡¯ She was able to find a contact to these people because the Swedes were in my village. Because there was a Swedish man who had come into Kenya.

He was a teacher, and his son¡­ He had a tragedy because his son died in a road accident. And he obviously was devastated. And he decided that he wanted to do something instead of just, you know, drowning in grief. He decided that he was going to start something to support the children of Kenya, because his son who died had been¡­ His name was Ola. Ola loved Kenyan children. He played with the children because they were living there. They were the only white people in, you know, 30 miles.

And he started something that was called the Ola Memorial Fund. And his name was Sven Magnusson, and everybody knew him in the village. Everybody was trying to get their kids supporters. So, you could hear my illiterate mother saying, ¡®I need to see Sven Magnusson.¡¯ And Sven had to do interviews. It's not everybody who was being accepted into the programme. You had to satisfy two criteria. You had to be smart. In other words, you had to be getting good grades. Because they couldn't take everyone. And so, my mother, she knocked on Magnusson¡¯s door many, many times. She was telling stories about how she waited outside there until she got a form with my name in it.

 

Melissa Fleming 17:10

 

So, they decided to give you a scholarship?

 

Chris Mburu 17:14

 

Yes, so a decision was made that I qualified. Even when you qualified, you did not automatically get it. The problem was getting a corresponding sponsor in Sweden.  But as Sven Magnusson was to tell us later, he¡¯d talked to this woman who was in his school. Her name was Hilde Back. And Hilde Back looked at this profile and said, ¡®I want to support this kid.¡¯

 

Melissa Fleming 17:43

 

This kid was you

 

Chris Mburu 17:44

 

This kid was me. Yeah, so that's exactly how it happened. It was by chance, I would say. I mean, Hilde could have said, ¡®Give me¡­ Keep the profiles coming.¡¯ But she said, ¡®I want to try support this kid.¡¯

 

Melissa Fleming 18:02

 

So, for Hilde, what did this mean? It meant a sum of money every month?

 

Chris Mburu 18:06

 

Yeah, it meant money once every term. And the Kenyan school term was four months. Because it was three terms in a year. And so, it was for¡­

 

Melissa Fleming 18:19

 

What kind of money could we imagine?

 

Chris Mburu 18:20

 

It was absolutely small amounts. You can't even¡­ I can't even describe them in dollar terms. Must have been less than $10.

 

Melissa Fleming 18:30

 

But that $10 three times a year made all the difference for you.

 

Chris Mburu 18:34

 

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that $10 was difficult to get. When my mother went to the coffee plantations, she probably got a fiftieth of that amount. So, it was not easy to raise that amount of money.

 

Melissa Fleming 18:48

 

Can you remember the day when you learned you were going to be funded for your school?

 

Chris Mburu 18:55

 

You know, I don't quite remember the day, but I remember being very, very happy after getting the assurance that I wasn't going¡­ I remember the white man coming to our home. And of course, you know, I was the main subject of the visit. So, he was trying to talk to me in Swahili and he was asking me, ¡®How is school?¡¯ And I said, ¡®It's great!¡¯ And, you know, ¡®What do you like about school?¡¯ And I said, ¡®I like playing with my friends. And I like English.¡¯ I started taking a liking to English, just because it was, you know, a new language for a kid.

¡®And what don't you like?¡¯ ¡®Mathematics.¡¯ I didn't really like mathematics. But yeah, so it [was] kind of an interview. They didn't, you know, put me on a seat to do an interview because they didn't want to do that for kids. The main interview was my mother. Like she was tense. I could see she was tense. She wanted it to be successful. But I was just playing around with the chickens. Not you know¡­And fascinated by this white man. We hadn't seen a lot of white people except the Catholic priests. So, a lot of people actually thought he was a priest.

So yeah, I was the subject of the visit, but I wasn't really bothered. I didn't know what the content of the discussion was. Except that after that I could¡­Even when you're a kid, you know when your mom is happy. You know, I could just see my mom is singing along as she walks around the garden, and she was happy about something. And then later on, she said, ¡®You will not be sent away from school anymore.¡¯ I was just happy. I didn't ask any questions. I was happy that I was going to spend more time with my friend Gitau.

 

 

Melissa Fleming 20:57

 

When did you find out who your benefactor was? Hilde Back.

 

Chris Mburu 21:01

 

At that point, I think the system they had was they didn't quite want¡­ Until they confirmed that the donor would maintain it. What Sven Magnusson wanted to do was just assure you that your kid was being supported without actually revealing the identity of the donor. And by the way, he didn't make the promise for multiple years. He said, ¡®This year, we have found money for your child.¡¯ And so, I think it was a year or two later that the name Hilde Back was placed on the table.

And my mother was told that the woman who was supporting me was a kindergarten teacher called Hilde Back. So, and then my life started changing. You know, we didn't wear shoes to school. We walked barefoot to the classroom. But then for me things, you know¡­ This poor boy, he started noticing that his life was becoming a little more interesting than the other kids. You know, shoes showed up. Hilde Back sent shoes from Sweden. And I remember my mother crying like it was so exciting for her. Because there were some kids who had shoes in school. Not many.

But I was among the poorest kids. And here I was wearing shoes. Not just shoes, but shoes from Sweden. So, you can imagine that transformation.

 

Melissa Fleming 22:43

 

They fit you.

 

Chris Mburu 22:46

 

They fit me. Yeah, I remember actually the first pair of shoes that came didn't quite fit me. But I was afraid of saying it didn't fit me because it would be taken back. I was afraid it would be taken back before I went to school with it. So, I kind of trotted in it feeling... You know, I didn't want to tell anyone that my toes are hurting. This is a coloured shoe, really beautiful. Most of the kids had black shoes.

And so, it was almost an overnight transformation. I became like Gitau. I became like any other kid who could afford things. I became even better because I had goodies that I would share with kids, and they loved me. And I had shoes.

 

Melissa Fleming 23:30

 

Her support carried through how long?

 

Chris Mburu 23:37

 

Hilde¡¯s support for me went for longer than normal. At that time, I didn't speak English. I couldn't write in English, so I couldn't communicate with her. But my elder sister took the role of intermediary. So, she's the one who would write the letters. I would stand there and say, ¡®Tell her this - that I'm very happy. That I have the coolest shoes in the school. That I really liked my shoes, and that I'm not missing in a class now. And I'm hoping to learn English one day so that I can write the letter to her myself to thank her.¡¯

 

Melissa Fleming 24:19

 

And you did.

 

Chris Mburu 24:20

 

And I did. So, she kind of started liking me. And you know, like asking me, you know, ¡®What kind of things do you like at school? You know, do you have teachers that give you a hard time as always?¡¯ I realized she was she was a human being, and it wasn't just an institution. I was exchanging with a woman called Hilde Back.

 

 

Melissa Fleming 24:41

 

And when did you start learning more about her?

 

Chris Mburu 24:45

 

I didn't learn much about Hilde Back - her story, her life. No, I didn't. I just knew that she was a kindergarten teacher. And then she kept renewing, and saying, ¡®I want [inaudible] support for next year.¡¯ And so, I never had the absences again. And then at this point, I started thinking, ¡®Maybe things are going to work out for me. I have somebody who is looking out for me. I have my mother who is supporting me in every way she could.¡¯ I had my friends, and I was doing well at school. Hilde was¡­ She was a teacher.

She used to give me a lot of orders. And it's her character. It's always been her character. She gives me orders you know, ¡®Don't listen to what the other boys are saying! Don't play too much! Just focus on school, on your schoolwork. Always do your homework after school.¡¯ And of course, what she didn't know is that I couldn't even¡­ I didn't even have a place to do homework because we didn't have electricity. So, at six o'clock, 6:30, when it grew dark that's it until the following day, I would never look at a book. Because, you know, we are sitting by the fire side while my mother is cooking. So, there were no conditions to sit down and do homework. But of course, her, she was thinking from Sweden that I had a little desk there with a with a lamp, reading my mathematics. But I didn't. My school results pleased her a lot. Especially when, you know, I was number one.

So, I really tried hard, and she really forced me to focus.

 

Melissa Fleming 26:39

 

So, you went into high school. You succeeded so well in high school, and then you ended up going to university.

 

Chris Mburu 26:47

 

Yeah, so she made the extraordinary decision to support me through secondary school. That was a breakthrough. So, I was able to go through secondary school. And then I was able to go to University of Nairobi, where I studied law. And then I got very interested in human rights law. And that's how I applied to go to the United States.

 

Melissa Fleming 27:15

 

And none other than Harvard Law School.

 

Chris Mburu 27:18

 

Yes, I was very lucky to be admitted to Harvard Law School for my master's in Law.

 

Melissa Fleming 27:23

 

That's actually quite remarkable. So, this was your first time out of the country. And then you ended up in Cambridge, Massachusetts.

 

Chris Mburu 27:32

 

Yes. Very cold Boston. I still remember¡­

 

Melissa Fleming 27:35

 

I know. I grew up there, so I know. But I didn't grow up in Kenya in the warmth. I was used to it. But I can imagine it must have been¡­

 

Chris Mburu 27:44

 

You know, I still remember that day when the winter really struck. It was so hard that at one point I called back home, and I said, ¡®I'm not sure I'm going to go through this.¡¯ Because it was the cold that people had been telling me about.

 

Melissa Fleming 28:02

 

You couldn't imagine¡­

 

Chris Mburu 28:03

 

It was like ten times¡­ People didn't tell me that it was like living in a freezer. I had absolutely no idea that human beings could live under those conditions.

 

Melissa Fleming 28:14

 

I imagine then you probably never forgot Hilde. Were you still in touch with her?

 

 

Chris Mburu 28:21

 

Yeah, I never forgot Hilde. And in fact, I thought about her often. We continued correspondence for a brief period. And then you know, we both got busy. And then years later. Actually, when I ended up at Harvard, and I realized, ¡®Look at my life. This is this is surreal.¡¯ And that's when I started thinking again seriously about Hilde. Remember, throughout the period she was helping me we never met. And so, I called up my sister and I said, ¡®Hilde Back.¡¯ She said, ¡®What about Hilde Back?¡¯ I said, ¡®Where is she?¡¯ She was like, ¡®Well, I don't know. We haven't¡­¡¯ And I said, ¡®Find me the last address that she used.¡¯ And my sister looked and couldn't find it. And she said she had given me the address, which actually was the case [inaudible]. And I think I'd misplaced it. I couldn't find the address.

I mean, I had done a lot of moves from, you know, Kenya to the US and all that. And I really desperately wanted to get in touch with her if only to tell her how my life was panning out. And I really hit a dead end. I couldn't find Hilde. I even at one point randomly spoke to Swedish people and I said, ¡®Might you know Hilde?¡¯ And, you know, like at the university. It wasn't like in the street. But like if I met somebody. And actually, that is what helped me find Hilde because like my mother, I just¡­ Once I'm focused on something, I don't stop. And I ended up staying much longer in America after Harvard. I got an internship. Then I got a job. And so, I was going back and forth to Kenya.

And on one occasion, when I was in Kenya, I was told there was a reception by the Swedish Embassy. And I thought, ¡®Okay. Here I'm going to try.¡¯ By then I'm working as a human rights officer with the United Nations in Eritrea. So, I have a job. A good job. And by then, I decided to start something in her name. Doing what she did with me, because there are so many kids who do not have an education. And so, I started this little initiative, and I called it the Hilde Back Education Fund. And I wrote to the ambassador, and I told the story. And I said, ¡®Look, I'm looking for this woman. This is what she did for me. Is there anything that your embassy could do to help locate this woman?¡¯

About six months after I'd written to the ambassador, I received a letter guess from who? Sven Magnusson. And here's the update: ¡®Hilde is very much alive and healthy. She's 79 years old now. We hear that you have started something in Hilde's name to support children who cannot go to school in Kenya. And I have told Hilde and she's very, very pleased. And she would like to get back in touch with you.¡¯ And I immediately¡­ I didn't even start my work. I just went on my computer. So excited. And I just wrote, ¡®Dear Hilde.¡¯ And I said, ¡®Hilde, what you did for me, I can't even believe I'm communicating with you right now.¡¯ And then at that point, with a little initiative that we had started, we wanted a little ceremony to launch it. And I thought at night at one point. I was awake at night. And I thought, what could be a better present for Hilde, if she could travel than to pay for her ticket to come to Kenya for the launching of the Hilde Back Education Fund. And that's exactly what happened.

I wrote her and I said, ¡®We are launching this thing. And I know we've never met. But I would like to offer you a ticket to come for the launching in Kenya.¡¯

 

Melissa Fleming 32:50

 

And she came.

 

Chris Mburu 32:52

 

And she came.

 

Melissa Fleming 32:53

 

And you met.

 

Chris Mburu 32:53

 

And we met. I didn't know her. I was waiting for this person who changed my life at the airport, yet I was carrying a little piece of paper with her name on it because I didn't know what she looked like. I mean, I did receive pictures of her ages ago. So, it was very interesting also, you know, that moment when she walked out of the luggage hall and kind of looking around. And, you know, she found me.

That first hug, you know, of these two strangers who had known each other but had never physically met. This was how many years later. 25-30 years. And so, we had a big ceremony to launch this. And of course, the ceremony became even bigger because Hilde Back herself was in town in the village. And our Member of Parliament was there to receive her, you know. The women of my village came out and, you know, [inaudible] out traditional dances. The kids were saying poems. You know, like we did a good organization to respect her arrival. And she was stunned. She could not believe it.

She later said that she felt like she was back in a home that she never knew existed. It was just fantastic. And for me you can imagine, you know, this woman had meant so much for me.

 

Melissa Fleming 34:30

 

Was your mother still alive?

 

Chris Mburu 34:31

 

My mother was there, was so beside herself with excitement. This is¡­ My mother used to joke around, by the way, when I was growing up, when I became a bit rebellious or whatever, she would say, ¡®I'm going to send you to your other mother in Sweden.¡¯ So, there was always this joke about my second mother. And then I discovered Hilde is just this joyous character. Cracks jokes. Just fits in every space. And she was quite excited.

 

 

Melissa Fleming 35:11

 

I believe at that time you started to learn about Hilde's own history and story.

 

Chris Mburu 35:16

 

Not really. Hilde was not the type to share. She was a Holocaust survivor. But she¡­ This did not come out until several years later, when again another angel surfaced in my life. This woman called Jennifer Arnold, who is an American who had spent a year abroad at Nairobi University. She had since become a filmmaker in Hollywood.

When she heard about the Hilde story, she decided to do a film about Hilde and myself. And it wasn't until Jennifer Arnold flew to Sweden to interview Hilde for the film that Hilde told the story of her past. So, I didn't know until Jennifer Arnold told me, ¡®Do you know that this story is bigger than you think?¡¯ Hilde Back was a Holocaust survivor. She had fled Germany at the age of 16 and moved to Sweden. And her parents were left, and they were killed in the concentration camps.

 

Melissa Fleming 36:29

 

And the film is called ¡°A Small Act¡±. I remember seeing it myself when it came out and being so moved. I think it really hit a nerve for a lot of people and gave people, including me, inspiration that you can do one thing and influence a person's life tremendously. So how has this sense of importance of small acts been reflected in your work for the UN?

 

Chris Mburu 36:58

 

Well, for me, a lot of people look at all the poverty in the world, and all the suffering in the world, and they say, ¡®What can I possibly do?¡¯ And then they just fold their hands, and they say, ¡®It's just overwhelming.¡¯

Hilde looked at all the problems facing children around the world. She did not say, ¡®What can I possibly do?¡¯ She chose one child, a small act.

And so even in development, it's important to think about that, the global development. But it's really very important to think about how you can localize that development. How do you help the communities around you? If you built a big mall in Nairobi, when I was growing up, it wasn't going to help me. It wasn't going to impact me. But if you brought running water into our compound, or I could suddenly switch on some little button and there is electricity. That to me is development.

And this is what I see around the world in all the places I've been lucky to be posted by the United Nations. You are dealing with communities. You are dealing with individuals who are facing greater poverty than I faced, or similar poverty as I faced. Try to transform the lives of those people.

 

Melissa Fleming 38:37

 

Chris, you're now in the Republic of Congo, where you've been since the beginning of the COVID-19 pandemic. What are the big challenges you are facing? And you know, as the leader of the UN there, and how are you trying to help Congo?

 

Chris Mburu 38:53

 

Well, Congo is a country that has faced significant challenges the last seven years. It is an oil producing country. And as you all know, the oil prices crashed in 2014. And that significantly affected the economy of the Congo and its ability to provide for its people. And our job is to accompany the government in finding durable solutions on poverty, on climate change, and all the other issues. And it was a particularly difficult time starting out in the Congo because I got in at the end of 2019. And within three months COVID struck. And now the situation is improving, especially as we go out of COVID. But then there was another setback with the war in Ukraine. Congo faced a situation where food prices went up because of the war. And now it's been a bit mitigated by the rise in oil revenues. But it was a very, very difficult few months after the outbreak of the war.

 

Melissa Fleming 40:15

 

Chris, what is keeping you awake at night, especially when it comes to fighting poverty?

 

Chris Mburu 40:21

 

For me, when I look at poverty, it evokes memories of my own childhood. What keeps me going is the desire to keep as many people as possible out of poverty, and to¡­ Because I remember my past, and where I was, I really do not want to see anybody there. So, my whole objective in my professional and private life is to try and pull out people - and in particular young, innocent children - out of poverty. So, for me, poverty is very, very personal. Everywhere I go, I try to ask myself this question, ¡®How can I help those people get out of that situation?¡¯ I look at every child I see as a little Chris Mburu back in the 70s. And I want to see myself as someone who can do something towards that situation instead of just letting those children suffer. We can't leave anyone behind.

 

Melissa Fleming 41:38

 

Chris, thank you very much for joining us.

 

Chris Mburu 41:40

 

Thank you.

 

Melissa Fleming 41:43

 

Thank you for listening to Awake at Night. We'll be back soon with more incredible and inspiring stories from people working to do some good in this world at a time of global crisis.

 

To find out more about the series and the extraordinary people featured, do visit un.org/awake-at-night. On Twitter, we¡¯re and I'm . Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts and please do take the time to review us. It helps more people find the show.

 

Thanks to my editor Bethany Bell, to Jen Thomas, Adam Paylor and the team at Purpose and to my colleagues at the UN: Roberta Politi, Katerina Kitidi, Geneva Damayanti, Tulin Battikhi, Bissera Kostova and the team at the UN studio. The original music for this podcast was written and performed by Nadine Shah and produced by Ben Hillier.